How to Explain You're a Furry/What a Furry is

Neox · March 20, 2013, 02:01:48 PM

Hahaha so much for NOT bringing up the adult shit. XD

Well since we're already ON that track, here's what I was going to say about that in my original post:

Whenever I'm asked about the adult side of the furry community, the most common question I'm asked is, "So... you're one of those people who fuck in the animal suits?" I usually respond with, "Ah... you've seen CSI." XD

Usually, when I'm confronted with this issue, it's different each time. Everyone has their own questions about it like, "Isn't this some sort of fetish?" "What's with all the furry porn on the internet?" "Why animals... isn't that like bestiality?"

Well, you need to understand that everyone has their own views and perspectives on being a furry. Not all of us are in it for the fursuiting just the same as not all of us are in it for the porn. Again, it stems from the creativity thing. We have a lot of artists who are very, very good at drawing peoples' characters--who are essentially avatars for their owners/creators--and when you get good enough at it, you start exploring different genres and content. A lot of the furry community is made up of males between the ages of 13-25. When you know a thing or two about that demographic, you'll know that most males in that age group are horny, and they will go out of their way to find "alternative" fantasies to get-off to. That's all it is, really. Fantasy. You talk to any person here who's into furry-porn and you'll find that their sex-lives are actually pretty vanilla. Furry porn is just a visual aid for most. To others, it's just a fun alternative to drawing the same old shit over and over again; they don't even get turned-on by it. The same way most people get-off watching regular old porn: they're not actually IN that scenario with the super-hot chick in the video; they're just getting-off on the fantasy of it all. No different with erotic furry art. And hell... I know a lot of regular people who enjoy furry-porn and aren't furries themselves. XD

The fursuit-sex is a totally different thing. It's a LOT less common than most people think and even a lot of furries think it's weird. It's not my cup o' tea but I won't bash on it since it's not really harming anyone and it certainly isn't affecting me in any way, but it DOES exist and a lot of people like to rip on furries just for that one, very small aspect of our community. I can't say much about it since I don't take part in it and I don't personally know of anyone who does, but you can look at it the same way some guys like their women to dress up in a French maid outfit, or a police officer. It's all about roleplay, and being something you're not. These people who do it in their fursuits are just pretending to be their characters the same way that these women are pretending to be a maid, or an officer, or a vampire or what the fuck ever.

It is sad, but true. People know about furries mostly because of the sexual controversy that surrounds our group. Either they found us via 4chan or saw that episode of CSI or some other stupid route that brought them here because of furry porn or fursuit sex. I believe it is important to explain it to them in a way that downplays the weirdness factor to them while helping them learn something about it that can allow them to nod their head and say, "I get it. Still kinda weird, but I get it."

All it takes is one person who knows what they're talking about and has a certain articulation about them. That's why I made this thread: I HAVE had a lot of success in explaining this shit to everyday people and I wanted to share some of my experience to help others prepare their OWN explanations and build confidence by actually HAVING their own understanding of the subject. I know that most people have difficulty explaining it to others because they don't even really know how to explain it to themselves. I didn't actually start thinking about it until probably a couple years ago when I began interacting in public events with this group. Now, nearly everyone at my work knows I'm a furry, and I work in a heavy industrial setting where you don't meet many folks with an imagination. All my coworkers are cool with it, and they actually ask me about some of my outings I go on with all of you guys with sincere interest.

I don't aim to convert anyone, or even try to make them like; I just want people to understand it so it's less foreign and freak-show to them.

So far, so good. =P

Drake Wingfire · March 20, 2013, 06:26:24 PM

But the adult shit is part of the fandom "ying-yang" I had to dive into that part of it because most people can adequate describe furry with the usual "we like animals and cartoons, hey we are just adults who never gave up on having fun, we are just a good ol bunch of people with a unique hobby" But when faced with the more taboo side, the ball tends to get severely dropped and it only makes the situation worse when dealing with something that is seen as taboo and strange.

I do agree though, how one personally handles the situation carries the vast amount of the weight to it and a real high effect on the outcome. A dodging or hesitant explanation leads on that one is hiding something or they think its "bad stuff" which in turn makes the person who is interested and asking feel like there is something seriously wrong here. But as we both stated, a calmer and more casual approach where such a thing is downplayed as "hey, boys will be boys" is a lot easier a pill to swallow. In the end being thought of as just some horny guy who also happens to like cartoon animals and drawing is a LOT better outcome than being vague and leaving people to guess things like "Does he fuck his neighbors cat? I dunno, but he seemed like he was hiding something soo..."

Neox · March 21, 2013, 07:18:45 AM

I was just avoiding the subject on these forums in particular because... well... PG forums are PG. I know we get away with a lot of non-PG blurbs here and there, but this is a full-blown discussion on something adult-related. *Is hoping this will still fit under the guidelines for informative purposes.* o.=.o

And you and I both know we can articulate the "clean" side of the community to anyone, but when I said that I watched a lot of furs completely shit the bed on explaining "vanilla furry" to a non-fur, I meant it. Yeah, a lot of folks really get caught with their pants down when confronted by the adult questions, but that's to be expected. I wouldn't fancy anyone at a bowling alley to just come up to me and ask me what position I prefer with my bf/gf. But I witnessed quite a few conversations between a fur and a regular dude where the fur was just stuttering to explain what the furry community is--in general. That was the main reason why I made this thread, was to help with folks who hadn't quite yet defined the furry community to THEMSELVES.

The major thing is that we all know we're furries, but most of us don't know what that really MEANS. Many of us just fell into it because we thought the art was cool, or we read a neat story, or someone dragged us along to a furmeet and we decided the people were cool enough to take a liking to. Not many people have clearly defined what being a furry actually means to them, and thus: when confronted with questions about it, they tend to hit a snag and freeze up. I'm just aiming at giving some people a base upon which to build their own definition so it becomes a little easier for them. :)

Drake Wingfire · March 21, 2013, 09:39:18 AM

Hmmm didn't think just mentioning the adult side of the fandom could be see as that risque. But I do know what you mean, the fandom is so broad and is quite the monogamous mixture of people that when trying to pin it down or describe it, the best that usually gets done is either a comparison to another fandom or something like "Its really just a bunch of younger people who love animals, cartoons and art, many of us are really artistic and we love to get together to share our art with others, we even create "Fursonas" as a way to show our favorite creature which we may identify with just cause we think they are awesome or even because we feel a special spiritual connection to that creature. But either way it gives us a unique way to interface with others."

Hah... actually I think I will have to remember that one... XD

On a brief de-rail of sorts.. What you described about furries falling into it with more of a unknown sense of being a fur is why I cannot stand Furry conversions. People who do sadly succeed with pulling that off just wind up making those fringe furs who don't really share that same sense of the fandom and who get stuck in those questioning situations because they never discovered it and grew into it, they just had a friend pressure them into making a fursona and joining a forum or FA haha.

Dervacor · March 21, 2013, 12:21:24 PM

My post was entirely meant to be informative of my real life approach to introducing the fandom. Because I've actually gone through the process (as many of you probably have as well) of introducing people to the concept when they ask me about it, or about why I took off a couple days around a weekend to go to a convention, I usually don't mention anything at -all- about sex. It just isn't relevant to introducing someone to this fandom, and if you do bring it up, you just seem weird especially if it is really someone's first time hearing about us.

We in the community, however, are aware of all of the extra issues we have to deal with when interfacing with the general public. The rest of my post was not meant to be graphic or adult in nature, it is just based on my own experience in addressing questions directly and pointedly asked when people with a little bit of experience with furries have asked. I figured it would be useful to people on the forum, and I did my best to underscore the fact that it shouldn't be part of the default dialogue, at that point it's really just reactive discussion rather than actively trying to thrust the topic onto someone. Meant only to be instructive. :)

I think you did a good job of describing this as well, Neox. There is really no situation in which I would dive into adult topics with someone asking simple questions about the fandom without having them first ask about it. That's really the distinction.

I see too many people respond to "so, what is being a furry about?" with "Well, first off, I don't have sex while wearing a fursuit."

You can see that kinda sets the wrong tone for every other conversation that could ever follow. Even if it's factually correct (which it is for me and I imagine most people I know) it just sours the whole concept and is pretty awkward. I'm on board with Neox on his approach really. I just wanted to also dive into the more aggressive questions I've been asked.

Some of the things I've had people ask is: "is this a fetish?" "what's with all the furry porn?" The best way to respond to these questions is mostly to be honest and cover it in a normal light (as Neox did I think), but it is super important that people differentiate THOSE questions from "what is being a furry about?" It's really an entirely different conversation, I tried to break up my post to show that. :)

Tef · March 21, 2013, 01:30:06 PM

First of all, I would like to bring my paws together for the folks - Marzi, Carthage, Carthage's dad, and Tony Greyfox who were running the panel at VancouFUR 2013.

I shall offer a disclaimer in advance that I'm speaking for myself and not for others in the Alcoffian sense of "The Problem of Speaking for Others"¹.

While I do not personally advocate for an intense chasm between the normative means of the production of culture in our contemporary society, there's one point that has to be made. The normative society that we all live in police us to conform. By police, I don't mean the unifying definition of the threat of incarceration, but the means of sensationalizing the deviant, magnifying the "underlying" fears of society, in its attempt to reaffirm the us/other, normative/deviant dichotomy that is on its brink of collapsing under its own scaffoldings of irony and contradiction.

In fact, at my risk of sounding as an all-out indiscriminate pessimist, everything is a contradiction, and the pursuit to find meaning in a fluid identity, furry or not-furry, normative or deviant, is in itself entangled in the paradox of creating meaning yet not creating meaning at the same time. You deal with one head of the hydra of society, two more will spring out to replace it.

Hence, in conclusion, as much as I want to throw the "Don't blame me, blame the dominant institutions of society," card is a sure-to-backfire approach...

¹ http://www.alcoff.com/content/speaothers.html

Neox · March 21, 2013, 03:55:59 PM

Quote from: Tef on March 21, 2013, 01:30:06 PM
First of all, I would like to bring my paws together for the folks - Marzi, Carthage, Carthage's dad, and Tony Greyfox who were running the panel at VancouFUR 2013.

I shall offer a disclaimer in advance that I'm speaking for myself and not for others in the Alcoffian sense of "The Problem of Speaking for Others"¹.

While I do not personally advocate for an intense chasm between the normative means of the production of culture in our contemporary society, there's one point that has to be made. The normative society that we all live in police us to conform. By police, I don't mean the unifying definition of the threat of incarceration, but the means of sensationalizing the deviant, magnifying the "underlying" fears of society, in its attempt to reaffirm the us/other, normative/deviant dichotomy that is on its brink of collapsing under its own scaffoldings of irony and contradiction.

In fact, at my risk of sounding as an all-out indiscriminate pessimist, everything is a contradiction, and the pursuit to find meaning in a fluid identity, furry or not-furry, normative or deviant, is in itself entangled in the paradox of creating meaning yet not creating meaning at the same time. You deal with one head of the hydra of society, two more will spring out to replace it.

Hence, in conclusion, as much as I want to throw the "Don't blame me, blame the dominant institutions of society," card is a sure-to-backfire approach...

Lol Tef. This thread isn't aiming at the gaps in society and social conditioning. I think most of us here are pretty savvy with the downfalls of straying away from the norms of society. This thread is 100% geared towards helping others understand their own definitions of "what it means to be a furry" and be able to formulate their own dialogue when explaining it to others.

Tef · March 21, 2013, 08:34:41 PM

How embarrassing, I apologize for my digression.

On my focus in terms of the response that I've received from my family regarding my explanation of the furry fandom...
I have provided here a very rough transcript of my first experience talking about the furry fandom with my parents.

Me: "Well, I met a whole bunch of people who are fans of animals,"
- "Fans of animals? So they're like, folks who are affiliated with the SPCA, or something?"
Me: "Close enough, but they are fans of anthropomorphic animals, you know those on two legs."
- "Like the cartoons you used to watch?"
Me: "Close, but it's more than that. It's like an animal identification. Y'know, like the Chinese Zodiac and how its animals and all that,"
- "So its a cultural fair"
Me: "Its people who hold a strong animal identity,"

I have to admit, I think I had it less with being directly confronted with the sexual aspects of the fandom, partly because I did not begin my explanation by stating what furry isn't about - as outlined by several folks a couple of posts back. The most I've get is from my parents is that "these people are not those you have met in school and universities, and since those are the only two places you've frequent, they are strangers and you should maintain a wariness of them".

Granted, I was quite introverted before joining the furry community, and the furry fandom was my first "dive" into communities outside of school for myself without the recommendations of others. So it's a bit of a shock to my parents when their boy suddenly switched from introvert to being part of a furry community.

Drake Wingfire · March 21, 2013, 10:08:46 PM

To be fair, that's still not a great explanation, more so like throwing little blips of stuff at them and leaving them to guess it and saying yay or nay if they get within 1 mile of the intended mark.

Using that method while being approached about a different subject would look like this..

"Me and a bunch of people sat around and did spiritual stuff"
--- Like praying or something?
"Kinda, but we didn't pray, we all sat around a fire and burned some plants while humming and saying stuff"
--- Like some sorta cult thing?
"Not entirely, we just sat there and zoning in and out and focused on the fire, it was a really deep experience"
---So you guys all just sat around a fire while smoking weed?
"I guess you can say that, but more spiritual"

As for the adult thing, there still seems to be some confusion.. I am advocating being prepared to handle that kind of situation IF it arises so ones robust description of the clean side of the fandom doesn't fall flat on its face and look like a big elaborate lie/diversion IF someone happens to ask about the adult side. I never said that telling people about the adult side is a must nor does it have to be part of ones description of the fandom. But to me its better to be prepare to handle that awkward subject and NOT have to talk about it, than just omitting that whole portion for the sake of "ignorance is bliss" and then getting caught with your pants down should that situation ever arise.

Simply put. If no one you talk to asks about the adult stuff, don't bring it up obviously. IF they do bring it up how ever, at least you are prepared to deal with it rather than totally dropping the ball and standing there just thinking "well fuck..."