Uninvited minors that just show up to 19+ events

Gizmo · July 15, 2012, 10:52:47 AM

I just wanted to get everyone's take on a situation that came up yesterday.

It was made VERY clear that this person was not invited to this event (based mostly on past behavior)
I made sure to contact this person in advance of the event to be sure he knew he was not welcomed to attend this event.

This is a PRIVATE event - and is posted as such!

This person chose to come to my event anyway.
If it were a local event, I am sure I would not be asking this question - but this person brought other people
(who were welcome to attend as they were of age), but this event was 2 hours from Vancouver.
Should I have sent the whole group away?
If I were to continue to accept this behavior, then there would be no limitations to my events.
Not to mention the legal implications of minors drinking alcohol in a public area that is HEAVILY patrolled by authorities.
If you were hosting a 19+ event,
would you want to know who I am talking about so you can be prepared that he might just 'show up' to your event?

What would you do?

Duffy · July 15, 2012, 11:02:18 AM

I would want to know who it is, if he's a troublemaker. if i am having an event, I certainly don't want ANY underage drinking or sexual behavior, with adults.

Temrin · July 15, 2012, 11:28:13 AM

:/ I would definitely want to know who it is. I dont host very many public events (and honestly, its for reasons like what you posted, that i keep it private.)
I'd rather avoid all that bs if i happen to want to organize something.

You say its based on previous behavior, but this person wasn't of age to drink i am assuming by the title.
I probably would of asked them to leave and if they did not, warn that i might ask some of the passing authorities to get involved if they could not be mature about it. -shrugs-
EDIT: doing these kinds of things is what will get them banned from local events. So i hope they smarten up.

Choco · July 15, 2012, 03:23:38 PM

well if it were me I'd ask the person to leave if you made it VERY clear that they are not welcome and if you kept ignoring it he's just gonna keep showing up and give people the wrong idea with minors around that should not be.

and I think I may know who your refering from your past events (I'm not good with remembering faces)

Lusiphur · July 15, 2012, 03:48:54 PM

Throwing my 2 cents in here (and having a bit of background insight into the situation that raised this post)...

If a person is not welcomed to an event... and the person who brought that person knew before bringing them that they weren't welcome to the event... a couple of things come to mind:
1) the person who was asked NOT to attend is being particularly disrespectful to the host of the event by disregarding this request and showing up anyway
2) the person who brought this person, knowing they had been asked not to attend is being equally, if not more, disrespectful to the host of the event

One would think that if this were to occur again the host would be well within their rights to ask all involved to leave... and advise them that they may not be welcome at future events due to their disregard for such things.

But that's just MY opinion ;)

Tyins Darkwulf · July 15, 2012, 06:02:51 PM

I think it is imperative to out this individual, and any other individuals that act in a manner not acceptable to attend furmeets organized on these forums; whether they are public, semi-private or even completely private gatherings. I say this because some people may be interested in hosting meets but they may not know a lot of people here either because they are new, or aren't as involved with the BC Furry community as others... and if this individual shows up and causes problems they probably would be turned off from hosting other meets in the future.

Regarding your situation with this person, I think you had every right to turn this person away regardless of how far away they traveled from, because like you said, you made it perfectly clear to them that they were not invited to attend due to their history at past meets. Plus, bringing minors to a 19+ even clearly shows ill intent. Honestly, from the sounds of it his presence was not only disrespectful to you but to the BC Fur community as a whole.

Unfortunately there are just people out there that like to stur up trouble, especially in the furry community, and the community as a whole needs to band together to prevent incidences that may jeopardize future meets.

Kitten · July 15, 2012, 09:21:14 PM

Having read all the other comments, I think you should not publicly "out" this person. I do think that you should have turned away them and their friends at your event, even though is was a 2hr drive out of town. The friends could have been given a welcome to your events on the condition that they don't allow the person in question to "tag" along.

I called the Vancouver info line 3-1-1 and they said if that person shows up at a party and they KNOW that they are not welcome then you should call the police(NON emergency line) and have them removed from the premises.

Hope that helps!!

tokar · July 15, 2012, 11:01:34 PM

knowing the person of whom the topic is about, and having spoken with the others in the car, it is my understanding that they did not know that 'he' was not permitted. granted he admits to reading an email 'recommending' (his words) that he not attend. so on that note i hold no blame to the ride giver and other passenger.

each situation requires a different application of regrets and punishments. in this case to have sent him away might have put him at risk, and to have sent his ride with him would have been unfair to the innocent. had this happened near transit then a 'thanks for coming, sorry you have to leave so soon' is justified.

to 'out' him is unfair but his name and reputation will get around.

Gizmo · July 15, 2012, 11:22:22 PM

Quote from: tokar on July 15, 2012, 11:01:34 PM
knowing the person of whom the topic is about, and having spoken with the others in the car, it is my understanding that they did not know that 'he' was not permitted. granted he admits to reading an email 'recommending' (his words) that he not attend. so on that note i hold no blame to the ride giver and other passenger.

each situation requires a different application of regrets and punishments. in this case to have sent him away might have put him at risk, and to have sent his ride with him would have been unfair to the innocent. had this happened near transit then a 'thanks for coming, sorry you have to leave so soon' is justified.

to 'out' him is unfair but his name and reputation will get around.

1) The e-mail to this person was very specific and stated that he was not permitted to attend this event
2) at least one other person in the transportation vehicle knew that he was not permitted - therefore, I lay 25% of the blame on this person as well as 75% on the person in question.
Clearly, there is a question about the lack of respect for the host of this event (me). There was definite knowledge of 'non-permission' in the vehicle.
I cannot 'babysit' at my events. This is why I ask people to request permission to attend. The direction this person was heading was reminiscent of CampFur (the unrestricted drinking of this minor - of Many types of alcohol (which can only lead to bad things for him and the people around him) - and that was exactly what I was trying to avoid. Almost always, this is not an issue. This person not only ignored my request for him to not attend, but neglected to even ask for permission to attend! I did check and it clearly states on the original post that you must request permission to attend. If that's not respecting the host, I don't know what is!!!

Tef · July 16, 2012, 08:36:30 AM

Truth is, Gizmo, you've tried everything that you could've done without laying the legal arm as a last resort, but given that whoever this person is persistent beyond your control, I'd say you really have no choice but to stop the situation from festering further.

Lusiphur · July 16, 2012, 09:24:25 AM

Quote from: tokar on July 15, 2012, 11:01:34 PMan email 'recommending' (his words) that he not attend.

My last input into this topic... if a host 'recommends' that you not come to their event... I'm sure you can see where I'm going here ;)

Neox · July 17, 2012, 05:22:02 AM

Make things black and white for the individual(s) you are addressing. I know the tendency to tiptoe around an issue with the intention of not hurting peoples' feelings, but situations like this require direct and to-the-point communication of the matter. A "No BS" policy needs to be enforced with this kind of thing. The person needs to be told:

1) They are not invited, and thus, not welcome at a particular event. (Sounds like you had this pretty well covered.)
2) If they arrive uninvited, they will be asked to leave.
3) Further, if they refuse to leave, RCMP or local police will be notified to have them removed from the premises.

Maybe, to try and nip it in the bud BEFORE the day of the event, a request should be made that anybody providing transportation for anyone BUT him/herself is required to disclose the names of the individuals coming with him/her.

Or perhaps it's worth discussing an administrative method for dealing with this issue.

Kitten · July 17, 2012, 11:03:57 AM

Quote from: Neox on July 17, 2012, 05:22:02 AM
Make things black and white for the individual(s) you are addressing. I know the tendency to tiptoe around an issue with the intention of not hurting peoples' feelings, but situations like this require direct and to-the-point communication of the matter. A "No BS" policy needs to be enforced with this kind of thing. The person needs to be told:

1) They are not invited, and thus, not welcome at a particular event. (Sounds like you had this pretty well covered.)
2) If they arrive uninvited, they will be asked to leave.
3) Further, if they refuse to leave, RCMP or local police will be notified to have them removed from the premises.

Maybe, to try and nip it in the bud BEFORE the day of the event, a request should be made that anybody providing transportation for anyone BUT him/herself is required to disclose the names of the individuals coming with him/her.

Or perhaps it's worth discussing an administrative method for dealing with this issue.

Thank you for also mentioning to have them removed by the police.

Choco · July 22, 2012, 11:51:38 PM

Thank you Kitten for mentioning the removal with the authorities suggestion if I ever do host an event which I would love to one day perhaps when I'm in a bigger place I'll have to keep that in mind if it comes to that

Ravenwood · July 23, 2012, 03:55:02 AM

I would have probably kicked them out. And made it absolutely clear, in no uncertain terms as to why they were not going to be allowed to stay, that being that the one that was not allowed to be there didn't tell them that he was banned from it (Or told them bu t they didn't care and brought him anyway.)

Next time, make it clear that anyone that shows up uninvited will be kicked out. Any driver bringing someone that is not invited in their vehicle may also be kicked out as well. Period.